Episode #077: Unconventional Marketing That Works with Dama Jue
Unconventional Marketing That Works with Dama Jue
I'm so excited to be joined this week by Dama Jue - she's an innovative force in the online marketing world that is doing things HER way, and making great money doing it!
Dama shares her journey from a traditional job in accounting, to becoming a Pinterest management service provider, and then evolving into funnels and self-study courses.
We explore why she choses to offer multiple products instead of one big signature course - a very different approach according to most marketers.
When you tune in you're going to learn...
Why Dama is an advocate for a multi-offer-product business instead of having one signature course.
How Dama was able to sell over 4,000 copies of a $9 offer - and what made it work so well
The Power of short (but impactful) 15-minute webinars for selling more offers
For all you out there ready to learn from a marketer who defies norms and redefines success - gear up for a session that promises to elevate your marketing mindset and help you stay, as always, not so average!
Links Mentioned:
Full Transcript:
Zach Spuckler:
This is Not Your Average Online Marketing Podcast, episode number 77. And in this episode, we're talking to my friend, Dama Jue, about how she's created a incredibly profitable business on her terms doing some kind of unconventional things. So if you have felt like any time in your online business journey, you don't wanna take the advice of someone that, you know, is leading you down the path, or you wanna do things a little unconventional, or you just like the idea of not doing what everyone else is doing, this episode is for you. So stay tuned. Hey. Hey. Hey. Not so average marketer.
Zach Spuckler:
Welcome to another episode of the podcast. Now I'm really really excited for this, because I've got my friend, Dama Jue, coming on today. And as you know, I I don't do a ton of guests, Though, we're starting to do more, which has been really exciting. And I love what Dama has done with her business. And we're gonna get into it in this episode, so I don't wanna give too much away. But she has done so many cool things. But there's 2 big things that I love about what she does.
Zach Spuckler:
1, is that she's created a really profitable business without having one big signature course. And we hear a lot in the online marketing world that you have to have that one big course, or everything has to lead to that one big course. And she's done something a little bit different, and and you'll get to hear about that. The other thing that I think is so cool is that she has built affiliate marketing into her online business model, where affiliate marketing makes up a really healthy percentage of her revenue every single year. And that's on top of what she's already doing. So it's a really cool episode. I don't wanna give away too much, so listen up, stay tuned. And without further ado, let me introduce you to Dama Jue.
Zach Spuckler:
Hey, Dama. Welcome to the show. I'm so excited to have you.
Dama Jue:
Thank you for having me. I'm so stoked. I've been wanting to chat with you like this for a long time.
Zach Spuckler:
So I know. It's gonna be so fun. And I have followed you, like, from afar for a couple years, and then we sort of, like we kinda, like I I always jokingly say, like, you touch circles. Right? So it's like we with, like, a mutual couple connections, and then we connected. And now we've done, some ads with you, and you've done some cool stuff with us. We've affiliated some of your products, and I just love what you do. Now I will start just gushing. So before I do that, can you tell us a little bit about yourself, your business, what you do, and, we'll go from there.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. So, my name is Dama Jue. I'm from San Francisco. I just moved to Hudson Valley couple years ago, but I'm still NorCal girl at heart. I went to school for international business and accounting, which was so boring. Like, oh my god. Accounting is so boring. Sorry, accountants, but, like, you know it in your heart.
Dama Jue:
And I always wanted more creativity. And I also struggled with just being bored and not engaged with my job. Also struggled with, like, the schedule. I am not alive at 8 AM, much less reading and replying to emails and sitting in on meetings. So I always knew it wasn't a fit. Wasn't feeling super satisfied and fulfilled by that. So in 20, what was it, 17 or 2018, my husband and I quit our jobs, sold all of our crap, and moved to Central America for a year. We were volunteering while we were there, and then I started my little side hustle there because we wanted to stay longer.
Dama Jue:
And I really like that expat life. And so we lived abroad for a year. Amazing. And when we came home, I I started interviewing for accounting jobs. And I'm literally sitting on an interview panel, like, yeah. This ain't it. I don't even wanna answer your stupid questions. I don't wanna be an accountant no more.
Dama Jue:
I wanna I I love my online business. So I'm glad I stayed with it because not that long later, like, pandemic happened and this sort of new infusion revolution with, like, the online business got new life again, got this big zhuzh of, you know, more people looking into this format and side hustles and stuff, the gig economy, all that stuff kinda happened, and I had already sort of established my business. So I started as a service provider, Pinterest management, then Pinterest ads. Again, did not find that stimulating enough. Eventually moved into funnels, and I've never left funnels. I've just I love that there's so many things you can so many levers you can pull. You can tweak the copy. You can tweak the design, the layout, the this, the that.
Dama Jue:
Maybe you need a follow-up email. Maybe you need less. Maybe you need a promo. I just love that there are so many levers to try when something isn't quite working. It really scratches that problem solver craving that I have. So I have a fully online business. It's, almost a 100% self study courses and templates and workshops. And I occasionally do a group program here and there, but it's mostly self study one to many.
Zach Spuckler:
I love it. And you said something that I think is, such a great jumping off point into some of the stuff we wanna talk about today, which is you said, like, you have all of these different different levers that you can pull and different things that you can play with, the design, the copy. And one of the things that I love about your business is that you do have a lot of different ways that people can work with you. And I think, you know, traditionally, like and and even in our business, it's very much like the, oh, have your one big thing. Right? And, like, for example, we have our membership. Right? That's, like, our one big thing that we're focusing on this year, and we don't really have a lot of ancillary products. And if we do, they lead to the membership. And so I'd love to just, hear kind of how did you come to this place where you were like, I don't necessarily need to have that one big thing, right? I'm a huge believer that you don't need to have the one big thing.
Zach Spuckler:
We're doing it for various reasons. But, like, how did you come to that point where you were like, man, I could just have this for this and this for that? And I think it really speaks to what you were saying is, like, that's that that I think a lot of us as entrepreneurs seek is that stimulation of, like, many different things. So did you first, did you have to come terms with that? And then kind of, like, how did you get to a point where you had, so many different products?
Dama Jue:
Yeah. So when I first started, I was a Pinterest manager. I found that very easy. I love to sell. I'm a natural, like, I'm a natural, like, people person. So that being a natural people person, it made it very easy to engage, like, on sales calls. And so I liked being a service provider, but I also didn't love that it felt like it was limiting, and I also got bored with Pinterest.
Dama Jue:
Being a Pinterest manager, you're right. You're scheduling, like, 20 pins a day for each client, and it's just, oh my god, the tedium. So I found so backing up a little bit, like, when you talk about being known for the one thing, there's there's merit and there's value in that, And it works for a lot of people. It just doesn't work for me. So I became known as a Pinterest person and I got this sort of reputation. I started speaking in summits. And I thought, okay. It's happening.
Dama Jue:
Like, I'm the go to for several people and this is great and it's great for referrals, but I also found it very, like, limiting. Because even in my own personal life, I'm not the go to for anything. Like, I like so many different things. I can wax poetic for hours about gardening, but also can get really nitty gritty on typography or on interior design or on the proper way to paint a wall, like, I I mean, I mean, I'm all over the place. I bake. I cook. I do this. I just can't I don't like being pigeonholed into one thing.
Dama Jue:
And as soon as I became the go to Pinterest person, I was like, oh, hi. I hate it here. Oh, I don't like this. This is boring, or I don't wanna be this, you know I I want to do more. And so I got to that point, and I thought I've gotta find a way to get out of Pinterest. I know, and this is the baby not yet a strategist in me. I was like, I'll just make a course. And then whenever interest comes my way, I'll send people to this course, which I only sold for $97, and I over I gave too much way too much for $97.
Dama Jue:
And as soon as I launched the course and I had my first digital product launch, it was $5,000, and I was like, oh my god. This isn't real life. This is real money. I'm like, wow. And then exactly 3 months later, reality set in that, like, oh, no. You launched a course. This doesn't mean you're stepping away from a topic. It means that you're chained to this topic forever because your students have questions or they want this, they they need help, and you're never ever going to not be the Pinterest person unless you just stop talking about Pinterest.
Dama Jue:
And so that was the first time really that I cried about my business because I realized, like, I thought I was this marketing person, and here I had this very short sighted solution. I'll just make a course so I never have to talk about Pinterest again. What? What was I thinking? So, anyway, it it was, like, this kind of big realization. I don't wanna be really niche down to one thing. And everyone's saying niche down, niche down, niche down, the more specific you can be, and it never sat well with me. I listened and I obeyed and diligently grew my business that way. But I just realized at a certain point, I don't like this. And that felt like such a failure to have launched this course, and then it turns out I kinda resented it and didn't wanna have anything to do with it. But you still have to sell it because now you don't have clients.
Dama Jue:
So, anyway, long story short, I pivoted into funnels, took a certification, and really learned how to become a copywriter, how to design funnels that, like, I really dove into something else. And I had already been studying funnels, but it wasn't until I took that certification that then because I'm now I can say I'm a certified funnel builder, like, I felt, like, confident enough to step away from Pinterest. And within funnels, there's just so much you can do that I've never really ran out of things. And I found that same "become known for the same thing" advice being regurgitated again and again. And I just thought, this just can't be it. You know? And so for a long time, I stayed with Pinterest. And then for a long time, I I moved on to Thrivecart. And I was just talking nonstop about Thrivecart, and I had, like, a template shop, and it was doing really well.
Dama Jue:
It was really lucrative for me. But even then, I was like, there's so much more. There's so much more I could be doing, and so it really shifted last year. So for, like, 19 2019, 2020, bit of 2021, it was mostly Pinterest. 2021, I started pivoting into funnels and only talked about funnels for a couple years. And then it wasn't until last year, 2023, where I was like, I know stuff about email marketing. Like, I have strategies, guys. Like, what? You know? And more people would copy my ideas, my so, like, I have this strategy that I call the Four by For Footer.
Dama Jue:
And I started seeing people copying it. In fact, I was on someone's email list, and I was like, lo and behold, that's my font, my format, my categories, my exact categories. Like, they really just lifted it straight from my emails and and put it on theirs, but, like, I'm on their email list. This is awkward. And so I thought, well, I should if I if I don't want people to copy it, I should say, here's a pay gate. Let me teach you. Well, because you don't even know the strategy. You know? Like, I could actually help you.
Dama Jue:
You're not doing this quite right. So last year was the 1st year where I sort of like, okay, ThriveCart's all about funnels. Sure. But, like, I have so much more to say about email marketing, about different tech, about Airtable, about automations because that was always my favorite thing to do was automations. And, like, you can't just have a funnel built on automations. You have to have the copy and all the other stuff, but that was the part that I liked the most, the inner nerd. So I just decided, you know what? Ah, screw it.
Dama Jue:
Let's just let let's just let loose. I'm just gonna teach what people wanna hear, and what people wanna learn about and what I'm having success with. So I kinda just said, well, here we go. I'm giving myself permission to just teach what people wanna know and what I'm having success with and see what happens, and it's worked out really well.
Zach Spuckler:
That's awesome. And one of the things that you said in there that I really love is you said, you know, I'm just doing the things that I wanna talk about and the things that I'm enjoying. And I I love that so much. I think that one of the reasons that we like our membership, and we typically don't plan more than 3 to 6 months out. Because I'm like, if I get bored, I can always tweak the topics and always change what I'm talking about. We're very Facebook ad centric, obviously, but, like, you know, it's like we have that cornerstone, and it sounds like you have that too. It's like funnels, but that's such an expansive topic. Right? It's the same thing with Facebook ads. Like, Facebook ads are great, but if you don't have a good landing page, if you don't have a good sales page, if you don't have, you know, the process or the emails or the the sequences afterwards, like, great.
Zach Spuckler:
People are clicking on your ads. And so what? And so I think we're very similar in that capacity, even though, you know, you have such a multiproduct suite. And one of the other things is, like, you know, you you mentioned this kind of in passing, and there is, like, you don't have, like, that one big central course. I know you do have, like, some higher ticket offers that are big courses, but, like, really, I I know we talked about this. Like, the the majority of the revenue really comes from, like, low ticket, which I know is subjective, but we're talking, like, under $300 to $500.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. I only have one. So I have 2 group programs. They're not open year round. Like, you cannot join. One has definitely brought in over 6 figures, but, you know, it doesn't really sell well on Evergreen. I have to do a big launch, and I find big, big, like, webinar launches kind of exhausting. So guess what? Your girl's just not doing it.
Dama Jue:
Like, I'm just not doing it. And if people wanna join, well, they can join on Evergreen, whatever. But my other group program is only open twice a year, and they're both $2500. So or they're they depending they depending on where you're at with it, it's anywhere between $2,000-2500. And I they just make up a small portion of my business. Emotionally, I'm not available to support people year round. I'm not available to have a group program or a membership year round or to be a coach year round. I've experimented with it, and I find myself as an em empathetic or an empath person.
Dama Jue:
If they're having a bad day, I'm then having a bad day for the rest of my day. Like, I had a program where, you know, like, they're they're doing a bundle launch and some students would come back and be like, well, I made 5 figures, but I didn't make this. Or I made, you know, I made $22,000, but I didn't make what I wanted. And I'm just like, you're sad about this, but, like, that's an incredible you know, like, that's such a win. Like, to me, this is a big w in the win column, and they're feeling sad about it. And instead of me being like, well, I'm just gonna cheer you up about it, I felt sad about it. You know? And so I'm like, maybe I'm not built for ongoing group programs. So all my stuff is either template or self study.
Dama Jue:
There and they're I don't do a lot of big courses, multi modules, lots of of lessons. I do either collections of tutorials with the strategy and the how to built in, or I do live workshops and it's like, I'll do the strategy and the broad strokes on the how to live, and then they get, like, the tech tutorial and templates on the back end. That's my favorite format because I feel like when I'm on camera and I'm live and, like, I'm feeding off their energy, I can do it in short spurts, but I'm not built for ongoing group programs. I noticed myself, like, emotionally, my emotional health, it's not good. So I can't really offer it. So all my stuff is pretty much self study. So I with the exception of one course, which is $495, everything is $297 or less. So some of my offers are $9 and some of those sell every single day.
Dama Jue:
And then I have templates that range in price that, yeah, they they all are. Yeah. That's all it's, like, all relatively low ticket. $297 is the max, basically.
Zach Spuckler:
Yeah. I I what I really love about that is that, you know, you're building the business around what works for you. You know, like, we, I always jokingly say, like, I feel like I'm insulated from other people's problem because I manage other people's money, which is, like, the most volatile thing to do. I'm sure you get that from the Pinterest ad side of things. It's, like, your ads clients are constantly we call them ad-motions. Like, people are just constantly on high alert every time I get on a call with a client. Even if things are going well, they're like, oh, this is great, but we are spending money. You know, how much should we be spending? And so I think that that has helped us a little bit.
Zach Spuckler:
But you're like, look, That doesn't work for me, and so I'm I'm just not gonna do it. And I think so often we see people in the online space preaching, like, the way. You know? And that's one of the things that I find most appealing about your business model, having been in your courses, having gone through your stuff is you're like, yes. Technically, there's a way to do it in the sense of, like, what buttons to click, very much like Facebook ads. But then there's, like, this understanding the strategy doesn't mean you have to use it this way or you have to use it that way. Like, we just bought, and we'll talk about this too. We just bought Convertbox, through your affiliate link, and you had all these, like, cool tutorials about ways to use it. And I was like, oh, I don't necessarily have to point blank use it that way, but this inspires me to do this, or this made me think about doing this.
Zach Spuckler:
Or, like, you have something in there that's, like, you know, collecting testimonials inside of a course. And I was like, I don't know that I would use it the way that you have it, but I totally can see this strategy and this strategy coming together. Not that the way you're doing it is bad, by the way. Dama has incredible resources and super WIP smart strategy. But I was like, oh, we wanna collect, images. And so I was like, what if we use this strategy and pull the type form in, and we use this little strategy and pull, you know, these images? And I was like, you know, that's what I love about your stuff is you're like, not only am I not gonna do what everyone else says to do, I'm gonna charge, like, reasonable rates based on my experience and results, and it's strategy that can be applied in a breadth of ways. And so I kinda touched on this briefly, but and and so did you. There's 2 things I wanna cover.
Zach Spuckler:
1, is that you have $9 products. And then you also will I I just wanna throw this out there so we can come back to it. I mentioned that we bought Convertbox or your affiliate link. You've also mentioned ThriveCart a couple of times. You've also built a really robust side of your business that is affiliate income. So, like, these things that we think about, like, the the a lot of the online world is like, oh, $9 products are, like, tongue in cheek, the gateway drug. Like, that's where you get people in. And I know for you, like, that is true in a sense, but I know you've also done very well with $9 products, through affiliates, through organic, through email.
Zach Spuckler:
And then affiliate income is always like, oh, this is, like, a small percentage of your revenue. Like, recommend it when you can, and you've made it a cornerstone in your business. So take it away. You can start with either one, but I wanna make sure we hit on both of those.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. So the $9 thing, I wasn't sold on this concept. I have always... I'm trying to think of a polite way to say this. I have never tried to go for bargain basement pricing. Just because all my offers are $297 or under doesn't mean that they're bargain price based pricing. Like, they're you you can buy a ThriveCart template from me and Chia Batey. Okay? It's a long form sales page. It's a Great.
Zach Spuckler:
We use them for one of our best performing sales pages, by the way
Dama Jue:
Yay. I love that for you and I. Like, so it's a long form sales page. It's got conversion copywriting prompts in it. It's got the upsell. It's got the downsell. It's got the success page.
Dama Jue:
I have bump design. Like, you get a full editable Canva brand board. Like, it's this. It's it's so good, and yet you could buy a ThriveCart template on Etsy that just uses, like, Canva graphics. It's literally, like, that's the template. You design it in Canva and upload it to ThriveCarT. You could do that for $37, but I don't talk to those people. Like, that's not what I'm here for.
Dama Jue:
I'm here for people who are, like, you know, really serious about their online business, and I want a proper sales page because I understand that com like, conversion copywriting is what sells this. So I don't mark my prod my templates range from $137 to $177. So they are not I do sort of have premium pricing, but they're so built out. They're so, like, tested, performant, and they come with everything you might possibly need that I don't feel bad that they're not, like, bargain based pricing. However so I was a little unsure about the $9 thing, but I had this idea. The biggest hesitation was I don't have anything that's, like, super low ticket. So if $177 feels impossible because there's some people who are just starting out or whatever, I wanted to have something available to them that solves a need that is not a course and is not, you know, a $177 ticket. Like, the it's just I wanted something available.
Dama Jue:
So, anyway, long story short, I created a training called On Brand Fillable Workbooks. It's a 50 something minute training. I recorded it in a single setting on a Sunday afternoon, and it's essentially going behind the scenes of my strategy. Because starting in 2021 and for my lead magnet, in 2021, I didn't like, like, designing my workbooks or my PDFs in Canva and then making the boxes fillable with, like, Adobe or whatever. It takes forever. Yeah. It takes forever. No one uses it.
Dama Jue:
Like, you just downloaded this PDF to your, like, hard drive. It's in some download folder or whatever. Like, you're never gonna find it. Just know. So I use I've been using editable, fillable Google Docs for my freebie since 2021, and it wasn't until 2023 when I finally was like, maybe I should teach this. Because then I I use them as course workbooks. I use them as a freebie. I use them as a digital product.
Dama Jue:
Like, this is such a, like, low lift thing for me, and it literally was born of laziness because I can design something to look nice in Google Docs in, like, 20 minutes, or I can spend 3 days in Canva and it still not be done. And I still haven't written the content. So, anyway, I did this $9 training called On Brand Fillable Workbooks, and it was the first thing that I sort of stepped out. Like, I'm not talking even about funnels. I'm not talking about ThriveCart. I'm not talking about Pinterest. This is literally so random, but it's a thing I've been doing in my business for years that works and makes sense. And Google Docs is just one of those things that's so accessible to so many people that the little puppy took off.
Dama Jue:
I have to date, or over 4,000 students in this training. So it has actually been lucrative. It's a lucrative offer for me. It sells almost every single day, not because of necessarily because of affiliates, but my affiliates love to promote it because it's like the page has such a high conversion rate. But, like, people just stumble upon it and they buy it and, like, they come to my site. Like, I have a convert box now that is like, are you looking for this? Like, at this point, like, statistically, if you're on my website, you might be looking for the Google Doc thing and not know what it's called or where to find it. So now I'm just like, hi. Here's the convert box.
Dama Jue:
Are you looking for this? Because I think you need this. Like, I have, you know, I have set up the the targeting that it's like, if they don't have the tag enrolled in On Brand Fillable Workbooks, I'm like, you need this. You need this. Right? Like, there you go. Let me put this in your hand. So, like, that product kinda cracked open a new world for me because I'm no longer just talking about Thrivecart. I'm an online business person, so let's talk about online business. And then ever since then, I was like, that's the floodgates.
Dama Jue:
Just cracked wide open. That was March of 2023, and then ever since then, it's just lots of other stuff. So I do have several $9 products. Not all of them have made me $20,000. Some of them have made me less one of them made me less than $300. But, hey, such is life.
Zach Spuckler:
I love that.
Dama Jue:
Still worth doing. So, anyway, that's the the low ticket side. And then the other side you asked me was affiliate marketing?
Zach Spuckler:
Yeah. Yeah. And and I just wanna say, like, that's I I love what you did there, and I think that there's, like, this subtlety to this that I wanna point out for people listening, which is, like, it doesn't necessarily, like, have to be directly related to the business you run, to be attracting the people who care about your business. Right? And so we have a really good example of this from every year from November. Hopefully, no one steals this idea because it's worked so well for us today. You could, but it works really well for us. From basically, like, November 1, sometimes October 15th to about January when we do our January launch, we run an ad that's like, come get your online course creator planner. It's like how to plan your 2020 whatever year we're in as a course creator.
Zach Spuckler:
And it's like, inherently, just because you wanna plan your year doesn't mean you wanna run Facebook ads. It doesn't mean you wanna be in our challenges, our boot camps, anything. But if you wanna be in those things, you do wanna plan your year. And I think that's kinda what you're seeing too is, like, if you're making an on brand fillable work workbook, I'm sure there's a segment of your population that's, like, in academia or is doing it for, like, you know, their kids, whatever. But then there's probably a healthy part of the yeah. That small part of the segment. There's a healthy part of that segment that's like, they're doing this because they have a course, a membership, a product, something that ding ding ding needs a funnel to continue to sell. And I just I just think there's so much beauty in the simplicity of that that sometimes we bend over backwards trying to be like, how do I make this the next step offer? Or what do I need to sell first to build that next step offer? And sometimes it's like, you just need to offer something that doesn't even need to be novel.
Zach Spuckler:
Sometimes this happens to be very novel, but it's like, it just has to be something that speaks to your people. It doesn't always have to be something that is what you sell. And I just think that there's so much beauty in that. And then, yeah, like, let let's talk a little bit about the affiliate because you also mentioned in there that you have a Convertbox, which is as a side note for anyone who doesn't know, Convertbox is like a little slide out in most cases. It actually has a lot of use case, but the one that you're talking about is when people visit Dama's site, it just kinda pops out on the side. It doesn't necessarily take over your screen like a full pop up, but it just pops out and says, hey. Are you looking for On Brand Fillable Google Docs? And it's like, click here, and it takes you right to the sales page. We just implemented it.
Zach Spuckler:
And I wanna say I'll I'll pull up stats while we're talking, but I wanna say something like 10% of people that see the page are, like, going to our, sales page for one of our our programs. And what's really cool about that oh, I'm I'm being dramatic. 5% 5% of people, which is still great because that's 5% of people that may not have made it to that sales page. So there's, like, so much value in that, but Convertbox, is one of the people that you're an affiliate for. So what a great segue into how you go affiliate marketing into a lot of your programs, products, services, offers.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. So just just thinking about, like, the $9 thing and and course creators needing to plan their year, course creators might or very likely will eventually want Facebook ads. If you I'm very clear on the sales page. We're on brand fillable workbooks. You can use this as a freebie, like a lead magnet. You can use it as a bonus inside your course or, you know, group program, or you can use it as a low ticket digital product. I'm not saying this is for, like, educators and, like, very generic copy. I am laser focused in terms of, like, this is for online business people.
Dama Jue:
Like, I don't know if you're a realtor, if this is the right thing for you, but, like, I'm talking to peep to my people who will eventually or could eventually be interested in ThriveCart or something else that I'm you know? Like, we're talking we're saying the word freebie. Maybe you wanna use my drip affiliate link. I don't know. We'll see. You know? But come on, like, come on in the water. It's fine. Like, you're my crowd. If you're interested in digital products, like, you're my crowd.
Dama Jue:
You I don't care if you use Kajabi or not or whatever. You might say, I'm tired of paying Kajabi $1800 bucks a year. Like, maybe I'm ready to finally move, or maybe I'm sick of their affiliate program. I'll just use ThriveCart for this. So I'm just there. Like, I am waiting. I I'm that girl who talks about ThriveCart a lot. So yeah.
Dama Jue:
So talking about affiliate income, I, as a Pinterest manager, got it in my head that I wanted to be I wanted to earn affiliate income, and my very first business coach was like, yeah. That's way down the line. She was thinking, like, of influencers. So she's like, that's way down the line. Like, that's not like a pipe dream. Don't focus on that. Show up on stories every day and sell your offers. And I was just like, okay.
Dama Jue:
Whatever. So I didn't really listen to her. I was like, I'm gonna pursue affiliate marketing. I didn't you know, like, I I'm gonna also pursue that while I pursue all my other things. So I built affiliate marketing kinda in from the beginning. So, people I love tech. I'm always testing things just, like, randomly. I hear about a new software, and I I will go down a rabbit hole and test it.
Dama Jue:
And so people ask me for tech recommendations a lot. I'm never, like, trying to shove it down anyone's throat, but, like, if they ask, then, yeah, and here, I'm gonna go ahead and give you an affiliate link. So as a funnel builder, my clients would ask me, should I do Kajabi or Kartra, or should I do this, or should I do that? And I actually had a more experience with Thrivecart being more reliable. There's a lot of glitches with Kajabi Cart sometimes. Kartra can have login issues, and the page builder can have issues. So I was just, like, very upfront, like, well, these can be problematic. I really like this software, and so I just made it my business to get better with using ThriveCart to become skilled at it and to become an affiliate. They didn't initially approve me, so I hustled like, I followed up.
Dama Jue:
I was like, hi. Excuse me. I'm a publisher. I wanna recommend your software. I have 2 clients who are ready to buy. They're not going to buy unless I say to buy. So are you gonna approve me? Like, I hustled my way in there a little bit. They approved me, and I made my first two commissions.
Dama Jue:
And I was like, okay. I should you know? I I like this. You know? Like, this is great. So as it went, like, throughout the years, I just started, like, doing a lot of affiliate marketing, recommending my favorite tech. I always recommend a tech on my email list. Even when I was a Pinterest person, people always wanna talk about, like, what do you use? Do you a Calendly girl or Acuity or whatever? They just wanna know. So I'm gonna share, and I'm always gonna use an affiliate link properly disclosed, of course. So that's always been in the background, but it really wasn't until 2022 when I got more serious about it where it started to become a bigger percentage.
Dama Jue:
And every year, it becomes a bigger percentage of my income. So for 2023, I believe it was, like, 30 some percent of my income was affiliate marketing. And I pursue it with as much vigor as I pursue growing my digital product business. So I often look at I intuitively love tech. Not everybody loves tech. A lot of people are allergic to tech. They get the tech sweats. I get that.
Dama Jue:
So I can not only recommend the software. I'm never just gonna recommend something and be like, well, there you go. Buy it, and I'll let you figure it out. I'm I love to show people the value and why I recommended that thing. So I ended up creating trainings and templates based on my favorite affiliate offers. So that's how ThriveCart template shop was born. I, like, I had no idea I was ever gonna create a template shop. I used to hate design and then eventually just got like, I did that certification.
Dama Jue:
I got better with it. I practiced, and then I I started building checkout templates for my clients, and then other people were like, so what are you using? There's none. I started googling to find templates. There weren't any. So I was like, maybe this is an opening. So I started offering that as my affiliate bonus, like a checkout template bundle. And then other people who had already bought Thrivecart were like, can I get that? Because I I yeah. That was the one of the conversations you and I had.
Dama Jue:
You're like, well, I I want this. I already have Thrivecart, but how do I get this if I already have Thrivecart? So then I launched the shop, and then she took off. So it just was kind of always folded in between. Another thing that I do that I really don't see anyone else doing, I call them mini webinars. They're 15 to 20 minute micro trainings where I'm literally talking about ThriveCart or Convertbox or some tech that I love, Drip, whatever it is. And not only am I just, like, want want, like, Drip versus ConvertKit, like, a very mechanical and boring, I share a lot of strategy on those, and I don't just tell people you can do this, you can do that. I tell people this is how I'm using Thrivecart, and here's a screenshot. I made $20k from this, you know, or whatever.
Dama Jue:
Like, it's like and I'm always big. If I'm gonna share a number, I'm gonna share a screenshot. So, like, for example, Convertbox, just Convertbox alone and strategic ways I use it in my business brought me an extra $5,000 in digital product sales in 2023, and that's only because I just started tracking in August. I've been using this software since 2021. So, like, in the last 5 months of the year, brought in $5,000. People are engaging with those little convert boxes, And I started tracking, it's having a very positive effect on my sales. And I thought I need to share this with people. So I actually made a 13 minute I mean, it's short, 13 minute mini webinar showing 3 strategies that are just beyond collecting an email address, 3 strategies that I'm showing that have proven to be really lucrative in my business.
Dama Jue:
So this these mini webinars accomplish two purposes. They end up buying the software with my affiliate link because I have a rocking bonus that they would have never heard about otherwise. They're maybe curious about the software. They see my 15 to 20 minute training. They end up grabbing it with my link. And then the bonus that they get with it, because I'm obsessive of the quality of my offers, I have a lot of return customers. Like, I say that with incredible, like, humility and pride. I'm I'm so delighted to be able to say that because it yeah.
Dama Jue:
I put so much into them that you hope that people will notice. Like, this girl really goes, like, a step beyond, and they do. And people were routinely telling me, like, I love how well like, your teaching style or how much you give. And so they get this free affiliate bonus. They got something for nothing. Right? They wanted the software. They got what they needed, and they're getting an epic bonus, usually includes templates. And I'm showing them how to use it, and I'm showing them sort of next level steps.
Dama Jue:
And then, of course, I have follow-up products that now they're in my ecosystem. They've seen how I teach. It's not, like, necessarily, like, oh, the state and switch. It's like, no. You're you're not getting anything subpar. Even though you didn't pay for it, you got it for free, you're still gonna get the very best of what I had to give. And guess what? There's plenty more over here, and all of it is I, you know, I strive to maintain this really high quality. So I don't treat affiliate income like a, oh, it'd be nice to have.
Dama Jue:
I plan my launches around them. I plan every pretty much launch I have has some duality to it. So if I'm talking about Four by For Footers, you better believe I'm shouting out Drip. You know? Like and I'm gonna also include my affiliate link for ConvertKit or whatever because so much of what I do is tech related. Like, why not? You wanna know what tech I'm using. People ask me all the time, what do you use for this? What do you use for that? I'm like, I use Drip because I love it, and it does this. And I chose it over ConvertKit because of that, and here's my link. You know? Like, there you go.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. So I try and weave them into every single launch. Digital products and affiliates, go hand in hand for me and for what I do, so it's a match.
Zach Spuckler:
Yeah. No. I love that. And I think the really cool thing about this, especially those 15 minute webinars, is, like, people are I don't wanna say over long webinars. Like, I still think they have a place and there's still benefit to them. But what's so great is that you have such a high impact, quick, easy to digest information. And it's like, oh, by the way, I've got these great bonuses. If you grab this software that if you like what I'm teaching you, you have to buy that software anyway, or you have to have a comparable software.
Zach Spuckler:
So, like, I'm just gonna help you use it. Like, it's so simple in concept, but genius in execution. That's like it may it makes it a no brainer. And you mentioned the other thing, like, that I love is, like, your content. Like, I think this is often overlooked in our space is that length of content is not quality of content, but your content is always so quality that people come to you. So, like, we've I mean, I think I flirted with Convert Box for a year, and then you were like, well, I'm doing it. You, like, mentioned it in passing, which I love, by the way. I love when people unabashedly share their affiliate links to their content.
Zach Spuckler:
I was like, yeah. You know, I've been eyeing up Convertbox. You were like, well, don't buy it yet because they're doing a promotion in a week, and I'm gonna be an affiliate for them. And I was like, cool. Done. And I think I even messaged you during it. It was like, I'm because I'm so I'm such a lazy person. I was like, I don't know where you sent it, but if you could just hit me with that affiliate link, like, I'll just go buy it.
Zach Spuckler:
And you are such a humble person that you were like, oh my gosh. It's no problem. When really if it was me, I'd have been like, literally, I sent 10 emails. Leave me alone. But you were very, very humble, and you were like, here's my link. Let me know if you need anything. And it's just really smart because you're building this business that the other benefit that's kind of, like, unspoken is, like, when you teach something, people have the software to do it. And so, like, one of our big obstacles that we have is people are like, well, can I do this and this? Can I do this and that? Can I do this and this? Can I do this and that? And you're like, hey.
Zach Spuckler:
You can maybe. Right? But you're like, you can do it in this. And if you do, I will get a commission, but you will get all the support and and content that you need to, like, execute it successfully. And I think that's just so genius, and we've touched on it a couple times. ThriveCart is such a huge software for us. I was poking around while I was looking. I mean, we have pages that have converted at, you know, 14%, 12%, 15% using some of your templates. Now we did get some copy support with those.
Zach Spuckler:
I won't lie, but, I mean, the template design is beautiful. And so, I know that you have ThriveCart template shop as one of, like, your your sub brands. And I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, that you have something really cool going on. We're dropping this episode March 7th, and you have something coming up very shortly around ThriveCart templates.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. So I don't come out with templates once a month. I come out when I I'm always kinda listening to what people need and what people are asking me for. I have a post purchase survey. So whenever someone buys something, literally anything from me, there's a survey like, hey. How'd you hear about me? Because I always wanna know what marketing channels are effective. What you know? And then I forget what else I ask. Like, how'd you hear about me? What made you decide to to buy today? And then the last question is, if I were to design a new Thrivecart template just for you, what would it be? And I really pay attention to that.
Dama Jue:
So I'm releasing 3 new templates, this month, and they always whenever I release something new, they always come in at the lowest price they'll you know, they're gonna ever be, then the lowest sticker price, so they are going to be on sale. And I'm also doing kind of a fun giveaway. I've never done this before, but when you purchase a template, you're automatically entered into a giveaway. And I'm actually gonna give away a gift of, like, a ThriveCart license. So you just grabbing a template because what I've noticed is I get this same question about a 1000000000 times. Hey, Dama, I run this like, I'll use Zach as an example. Like, I have a candle business, and I also have a Facebook ads business, and I also have this, like, candy business.
Dama Jue:
Like, can I run all 3 of my businesses through my same Thrivecart and my yoga practice and my this and my you know? And it's you really it works best when you have a separate Thrivecart account for each different business because of branding and, like, URL and all all the things. It just works better when you have a separate Thrivecart account for each, and it's the same for Kajabi. You'd need 2 Kajabi logins. It's the same. Right? But people wanna make it happen. They wanna make it work and but so what I'm doing is I'm giving away a license because so many of us entrepreneurs are serial entrepreneurs and have, like, multiple businesses living rent free in our mind. So I thought, you know what? This will be a really fun giveaway, and I can you know, they getting Thrivecart with like, getting it for free would be incredible, and then I'm gonna give them my affiliate bonus too because why not? Like, you should get my template library. Like, why should you figure that out? Like, why should you have to buy it? Like, you get it all for free.
Dama Jue:
So, anyway, it's kind of a fun thing. I've never done it before, so we'll see how it goes, but we'll be releasing 3 new templates for very like, highly requested, products. I'm not gonna say which ones yet. You're gonna actually have to come look.
Zach Spuckler:
I love it. And what date are those dropping?
Dama Jue:
That sale is happening. So they're they're all dropping on March 12th, and the sale is March 12th to 18th. That's when they're gonna be discounted at their intro price, and the whole giveaway thing is happening too. So, yeah, March 12th through 18th. You can get them after that. They're just gonna be more expensive, so you may as well just get them then.
Zach Spuckler:
And we'll link up to those in the show notes, heartsoulhustle.com/dama. I am an affiliate for Dama's templates. I love them. We use them. We're all about them. If you've ever gotten a Thrivecart template from me, this is nothing compared to what Dama gives you.
Zach Spuckler:
My I do templates for, like, 2 of my programs, and it's literally, like, put your headline here, Put your topic here, and then we have a workbook that goes with it for the program. But what you create, like, you've already mentioned, is, like, Canva templates, brand boards. I mean, chef's kiss. I mean, so good. So we'll, we'll link those up for the in the show notes for you guys to check out. I will likely be including them in an email the week of the I don't know what when the weeks are anymore. But somewhere between 12th and the 18th, you're gonna hear about them from me again. So, yeah, this has been so good.
Zach Spuckler:
I love what you have to share, and I hope that people really take away that, like, the what what has always drawn me to your business is, like, you just do what you wanna do, and you think and and I think when people hear that, they're like, well, well, you could do anything and make money. But it's like, you have the intention and the strategy behind it. And it's such a, like, beautiful thing to witness is, like, so many people are like, I'm just gonna do what I wanna do. Like, you know, I don't care what my coach says. I don't care what this person says. I don't care what that person. I'm gonna do it my way. But you and you've done that into a to a point, but you also then layer in, like, what's the thought process? What's the strategy? How am I doing this? Why am I doing this? And I think that's where so many, rebellious spirits fall short is they're just doing it because they don't want to, but they like something else.
Zach Spuckler:
But you're doing it in a way that serves you, serves your lifestyle, serves your customers, and it's just such an incredible thing to witness. As we start to wrap up, is there any parting words you'd like to leave our audience with? And then, guys, we will I'll do a little recap of the episode after Dama jumps out, and, we'll link you up with the show notes.
Dama Jue:
Yeah. I I just feel one last thing that came to mind as you were just sort of chat chatting right then that you're gonna you're gonna continue to hear a lot of, like, the more specific you can be, the more niche down. And sure. But you don't know what to niche down into. It's almost like forcing high school seniors to pick a major and map out the rest of their life when they have no idea. That's why so many people graduate from college and then do nothing with their degree and complete it. Complete opposite direction. I think you should try a lot of stuff until you get to where you want.
Dama Jue:
And if ever you're being coached by someone and they are telling you something that you just know in your gut is not the right direction, bet on yourself. No one knows your business like you do. So for example, I was in a mastermind a couple years ago with a person who was I felt like, wow. So much further ahead in business for me, And she told me, don't I was toying with creating bundle formula, this group program for hosting hosting a digital product bundle. And she told me, don't bother with that. Just run at like, let's focus on the Thrivecart template shop. Let's scale the template shop. And I was like, no.
Dama Jue:
I'm I see you. I hear you. Respect. But, like, no. I'm gonna go launch this. And, of course, they brought in 6 figures, and, of course, I was right. And no one knows your business better than you. So I just feel like if you're ever feeling like you're being pushed into a little corner, like, you should niche, but your gut is telling you go another way, just try it.
Dama Jue:
See what happens. And there's honestly no no fail case. Like, maybe it didn't sell as much as you wanted. Oh, well. You'll learn something from that. Mhmm.
Zach Spuckler:
I love that. And we tell people in our coaching all the time, this is just what I think. You know? If you're ever working with we tell our our students something very similar, which is, like, if you're ever working with a mentor who's telling you, you must, you should, you you have to. That's a red flag. You know, we tell people, this is what I would do. This is what I would do in your position. And if that doesn't resonate with you, that's okay too. Like, work with people, have people in your corner who are gonna go, you know, like, I think I could sincerely tell Dama, like, man, I really think you should double down on your ads.
Zach Spuckler:
And if Dama says, no. I'm not going to, I'm not gonna have my ego hurt, and Dama is not gonna be like, wow. I let Zack down by not doubling down on my ad spend. You know, just from, like, a a friend or a friend or a coach or whatever relationship it is, have people in your corner like that where not everything is an ego bruise and not everything is taken personally because that is gonna take you so much further.
Dama Jue:
And just mess around and find out.
Zach Spuckler:
Fun. Yeah.
Dama Jue:
It's the fun part, so why not?
Zach Spuckler:
I love it. Well, Dama, thank you so much for being here today. This was so fun. I just love chatting with you. Every time we get to connect is always so great. And like I said, guys, in just a moment, we will link up to the show notes, the the transcripts, all that good stuff. We'll have links to all of Dama's resources. She's mentioned a few here, so we will link them all up.
Zach Spuckler:
Her mini webinars, her $9 Google Doc trainings. Like, we're gonna link up everything. I'm an affiliate for it, so it would behoove me to link it all up. So we'll link up to everything. We'll have it in the show notes. And, Dama, thank you so much for being here.
Dama Jue:
Thank you. This was so much fun.
Zach Spuckler:
Alright. So there's some really cool stuff to unpack from this interview, and I love what Dama has been able to do. And and there's 2 or 3 really big things that I wanna point out. The first is that, number 1, the really cool thing is that, Dama isn't necessarily doing things conventionally, but she's doing things strategically. And I mentioned that towards the end of the interview. And I just wanna encourage you that if someone's telling you that you have to do something or that you have to do it a certain way, that there's always different ways, you know. A lot of times, we watch these online webinars and they're like, you can stay stuck or you can follow my system. And Dama is living proof that that's just a little dramatic, you know.
Zach Spuckler:
You don't have to stay stuck or follow the advice to someone else. You can forge your own path. The other thing I thought was so cool is that she is not just creating content, and she's got, you know, her mini webinars and her $9 products, but she's creating good content. She's creating quality content at a really great price point. And, you know, we didn't talk a ton about this, but I can tell you personally from being in her programs that she wows you with her content. You know, it's not, like, ridiculously produced. It's not like she's hired a professional course team. But what she does do is make sure that her content is punchy, strategic, and actually gets people results.
Zach Spuckler:
And what that does is it creates customer loyalty. You know, we talked briefly about that as well. And I think if you listen to this episode and you you take something away, it's that great content begets great loyalty. And if you do have multiple products or and like in our case, we have our membership where we're trying to get people to join us every single month. Customer loyalty is huge. And finally, the the other thing I wanted to mention was that, you know, Dama said briefly that she had heard this idea of a $9 product, and she thought, you know, I don't know if I wanna do that, but she tried it. Right? When it aligned with her goals and when she found something that that fit with a strategy that she wasn't totally sure about, she went for it. And she ended up selling thousands of copies of this $9 offer.
Zach Spuckler:
And it's just so cool what she's been able to do with that, because she took a risk and she tried something. And she even said, you know, if you try something and it flops, that's not the end of the world. She said she has a $9 product that hasn't even crossed the $500 threshold, but she's always willing to try something new. So I hope you got massive value from this episode. Anytime I get to talk to Dama, it's a good time, whether it's recorded or not. And I hope that you kind of enjoyed being a fly on the wall for such a fun conversation. Now if you want a copy of the full transcript, show notes, anything that we discussed today, you can head over to heartsoulhustle.com/nyap077. Again, that's heartsoulhustle.com/nyap077 for Not Your Average Podcast, episode number 77.
Zach Spuckler:
Now in that show note, I'll also link up to all the cool stuff that Dama has talked about, her $9 Google Doc, that upcoming Thrivecart sale she's got going on, her mini webinars. Like, she has so much cool stuff to check out. I highly recommend you do. And, you know, I just I really hope you enjoyed this episode. As a reminder, if you did, don't be afraid to leave a review. We love getting reviews from you guys and reading them. You can leave them in podcast, podcast. No.
Zach Spuckler:
It is called Podcast Now. On Apple Podcasts, which is the app on your phone. It's called Podcast Now. Or you can leave them over on Spotify. We have, the show hosted in both places, and we love getting reviews. So I hope you have an incredible rest of your day, week, month, year. And until next time, stay not so average.
